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Jul 20, 2021

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society.


The pandemic has accelerated retailers’ e-commerce strategies, and both warehouse and store infrastructure are radically changing to support this. However, during these infrastructure upgrades, fire protection is frequently one of the last items on the construction checklist. The failure to address proper fire protection can have a dramatic impact on final renovation/construction project cost, daily fulfillment operations, and business continuity should a fire occur.


Addressing this topic today along with Justin Smulison is Leonard Ramo, the President of Telgian Engineering & Consulting and a globally recognized fire protection industry professional with a distinguished career spanning more than 25 years. His expertise includes effective corporate executive, practicing fire protection engineer, and consultant to international organizations.


In this conversation, Leonard offers invaluable insights on how you can reassess fire risk as your e-commerce business grows and evolves. He speaks about proactive full-scale fire tests, the fire and life safety risks associated with infrastructure changes, and how addressing fire safety early in the process can result in millions of dollars saved for clients.


Key Takeaways:

[:01] About RIMS’s Global Membership.

[:12] About the RIMS buyer’s guide.

[:46] About today’s episode.

[:52] Would you like to lead a session at the RIMS Canada Conference? Submit your session proposal by July 23rd!

[1:16] Upcoming RIMS virtual offerings!

[2:17] More about today’s episode with Leonard Ramo.

[2:56] Justin welcomes Leonard Ramo to RIMScast!

[3:04] Leonard shares how he has seen the supply chain pivot since the pandemic.

[4:21] What automation has done to the level of risk in warehouses.

[6:39] Leonard expands on how fire safety’s position on organizations’ risk registers has changed.

[8:39] Why fire safety is incredibly important and various fire hazards that organizations should be aware of.

[10:45] Best methods of testing for fire protection and safety.

[14:04] About upcoming RIMS Workshops, programs, and volunteer opportunities!

[15:40] About the early bird rates for the RIMS Canada Conference and where to register!

[16:10] The differences between a building code and a safety code.

[17:40] The most effective ways that risk professionals can enforce their practices in countries or areas with weak building codes.

[22:02] Justin thanks Lenoard Ramo for joining RIMScast once again and shares some of the links to look out for in this episode’s show notes.


Mentioned in this Episode:

RIMS Events, Education, and Services:

RIMS Canada Conference 2021: Register for early bird rates!

RIMS ERM Conference 2021 will be held Nov. 11th & 12th in NYC — Submit a session by July 23rd

RIMS Buyers Guide

Upcoming Webinars:

July 26, 2021 | “RIMS and the RIMS Rocky Mountain Chapter Present: ‘A Discussion of Lloyd’s of London’s ESG Report 2020’” — Open Exclusively to RIMS Members!

July 29, 2021 | “How Better Data Is Transforming Risk Management & The Commercial Property Insurance Industry” | Sponsored by Archipelago

August 26, 2021 | “Increased Dependencies on Third Parties: Addressing Cloud, Vendor, and Business Partner Relationships and Risk” | Sponsored by HITRUST

Virtual Workshops:

RIMS-CRMP Exam Prep Virtual Workshops (July & August 2021) — Gain an edge with the RIMS-CRMP; the only internationally accredited risk management certification!

RIMS Virtual Workshops: Claims Management — Register now for Aug. 23‒24th or Nov. 8‒9th

RIMS Risk Appetite Management Virtual Workshop — July 21‒22nd

Registration for the VIRTUAL Spencer & Gallagher Golf Tournament is now open! Visit for more information and to register through August 15th, 2021 (You choose the golf course and team all while continuing to support the Spencer Educational Foundation!)

Spencer’s Risk Manager on Campus Program — Volunteer Today!

Previous RIMScast Episodes:

“California Wildfires: Risks, Preparedness, Business Continuity, and the Impact on Insurance Markets”

“Sustainability, ERM, and Construction with Kyle Van Hoeven”

“International Codes and Standards with Chris Wieczorek”

“Climate Change, Business Interruption, and the 2021 Hurricane Season”

Download any episode of RIMScast.

RIMS Publications, Content, and Links:

RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community!

RIMS Virtual Workshops

Upcoming RIMS Webinars

On-Demand Webinars

RIMS Advisory Services — Ask a Peer

Risk Management Magazine

Risk Management Monitor

RIMS Coronavirus Information Center

RIMS Risk Leaders Series — New interview with RIMS 2021 Risk Manager of the Year, Michael Harrington!

RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP)

RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring guests, Charles Vu and Steve Pottle!

Spencer Educational Foundation


Want to Learn More?

Keep up with the podcast on and listen on iTunes.

Have a question or suggestion? Email:


Join the Conversation!

Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook and Twitter, and LinkedIn.


Follow up with Our Guest:

Leonard Ramo’s LinkedIn

Leonard Ramo’s Profile on Telgian


Tweetables (For Social Media Use):


“‘Why would I follow the code or do testing?’ Well, it’s easy; with all the changes that are out there … it actually gets down to not only a risk standpoint but a dollars and cents standpoint.” — Leonard Ramo


“The ROI — Return on Investment — for doing fire testing for these ASRF structures is dramatic. We see that in one building, one array, you will recover the costs of all your testing and put you in a much better position from a risk standpoint.” — Leonard Ramo


“Of all of the places I’ve been internationally, no one has ever not wanted to do the right thing. It’s just that they didn’t know what the ‘right thing’ was.” — Leonard Ramo


“It’s one thing to go out there and publish a safety document and train anyone on how to do it but if you don’t go out there and do a follow-up to make sure that they do it — … that’s where we really have to … make sure that practices are enforced. ” — Leonard Ramo